a few non-exhaustive words about privilege

[sophiaserpentia]

A friend pointed me to this list of privilege the other day. Quoting bits which are relevant to frequent discussion in this journal:

privilege is consistently responding to disagreement, criticism, and concerns with condescension and hostility, then accusing the unprivileged of being irrational, inconsistent, duplicitous, guileful, and unappeasable

privilege is feeling entitled to the conformity in behaviours and attitudes of the unprivileged

privilege is not having to be self-conscious and self-critical

privilege is the habit of seeking power and influence over others

the privileged sees power over others as success

privilege is the ability to start, end, and avoid discussion with little consequence

privilege is shelter from direct consequences

privilege is feeling entitled to be better off than others

I want to add a few of my own:

Privilege means not having to wonder, ever, if people around you are regularly putting your needs ahead of theirs.

Privilege means being able to laugh at certain kinds of joke instead of being aware of your inferiority.

Privilege means not having to worry about the effects of your words or actions.

Edit. It was correctly pointed out that this list reflects the automatic assumption or perhaps assertion-by-default of privilege.

Comments

[contentlove.livejournal.com]

Excuse me, but it sounds like you are describing "automatic assumption of privilege" as opposed to privilege. Unless, of course, we're demonizing all privilege today in which case have at it, but I won't be joining you.

[sophiaserpentia.livejournal.com]

You're right. I edited the post accordingly.

[contentlove.livejournal.com]

No, actually, I take that back. Taking a closer look at the list, theirs and yours, I see a mixture of "automatic assumption of privilege" and actual privilege. And I see one statement that doesn't actually make a lot of sense outside of its context on this list.

In some of the statements, if they were reworded to say "it may be a privilege to..." I could get behind them. Like, it may be a privilege to not be self-conscious and self-critical but it may simply be an indication of mental health and a reasonable amount of personal security.

Unless you want to argue that someone who is providing a reasonable living for themselves and doesn't care that much what other people think about that is privileged. From a certain perspective, that would be true, I suppose, but it starts to tilt everything to privilege (like "breathing freely is a privilege" ) at which point I think the concept gets devalued.

the privileged sees power over others as success

I don't necessarily buy that. Some people with some privileges may feel that way, many don't in my experience. I consider this empty rhet.

privilege is the ability to start, end, and avoid discussion with little consequence

I would agree, that in some circumstances this would be a privilege. I would strongly say that assuming an automatic pass on circumstances indicates an assumption of privilege, however.

Privilege means not having to wonder, ever, if people around you are regularly putting your needs ahead of theirs.

I'm not sure that has a damned thing to do with privilege. I feel privileged in many ways, but I also feel like I have a basic understanding of human nature so I don't have to wonder. I know. Some people are putting their needs ahead of mine.

Privilege means being able to laugh at certain kinds of joke instead of being aware of your inferiority.

Interesting skew, false dichotomy. The choices here are either to laugh at a joke or feel inferior? I think not. But, I could understand, if one constantly actually feels generally inferior as opposed to noticing that someone is attempting to make one feel inferior, then it would seem like a privilege to feel not equal on some level. But I don't think of that as either a privilege or a right, in truth. Human feelings are a bit more nuanced than that. In any case, it is neither a privilege nor a right that can be guaranteed or easily given to anyone regardless of their economic, social, or other status. So I'd say it's "a boon" or "a gift" rather than "a privilege" and I'd say it has a lot more to do with basic nature than any other factor.

Privilege means not having to worry about the effects of your words or actions.

Yep, that would be a privilege. Because we're back to the "no consequences" thing.

See, I'd say that's the basis of privilege, no consequences. Not the simple ability to do or feel or say or whatever. But what happens when we do them.

[contentlove.livejournal.com]

Maybe we should also be discussing the difference between natural privilege (i.e. talents or inherant gifts), earned privilege, and assumed privilege.

I'd say that my big bitches with privilege is when someone who assumes it starts acting like it is based on a talent or gift. For instance, if you're born into a family with a certain amount of money, and a lot of things are provided for you, if you get snerky about other people who don't have them and start talking about their "laziness" or whatever. Or if you're gifted intellectually and don't understand why everyone can't pass the test like you did.

[sophiaserpentia.livejournal.com]

> the privileged sees power over others as success

I don't necessarily buy that. Some people with some privileges may feel that way, many don't in my experience. I consider this empty rhet.

I debated not including this one, for that reason: it is a highly generalized statement. It does point to something though, and i think with some tweaking it makes a valid point about the distinction between having privilege and not being aware of it, and not having privilege and being very aware of that. I do not read it as intended to be a general statement about power exchange (particularly on the interpersonal level).


Interesting skew, false dichotomy.

Please see my comment below.


I feel privileged in many ways, but I also feel like I have a basic understanding of human nature so I don't have to wonder. I know. Some people are putting their needs ahead of mine.

Awareness naturally works in that direction, but does not naturally work in the other direction. Knowing that other people are putting their needs ahead of yours does not necessarily translate to having occasion to wonder if you are benefitting from other people's deference-sacrifice.

I'm trying to find a way to phrase something that i learned while being raised as a white boy. I suppose it could point to "being spoiled" rather than "having privilege" (assuming that distinction points to an actual difference) but it was a rude awakening to realize that i was benefitting from the deference-sacrifices of people around me and i was not even consciously aware of it, though i was definitely aware of disruptions in that deference.

[sophiaserpentia.livejournal.com]

Some of these things are very hard to describe using language, and i believe this is because language is meant to affirm certain things by giving us words for them -- and to hide other things by not giving us words for them.

Privilege (as understood in feminist/critical theory) is one of those things that we just don't have words for. If you have it, you are not aware of having it, but if you don't have it, awareness of that fact slaps you in the face every day.

Most of us can relate to some degree of not having privilege, but we are just not conscious of it. Thinking about privilege while keeping in mind that there is probably some sense in which you don't have it can help most of us to understand what is meant by all this.

There is a way in which humor is usually used to make statements from the perspective of group privilege. If a joke about a group to which you belong makes you feel bad instead of making you want to laugh, you're told you "just can't take a joke." But the thing is, many people in the privileged group see it as a kind of innate right to be able to tell jokes of that sort without having to worry about the consequences. I wish i had a dollar for every time i've seen someone act wounded because they were asked to consider the way in which their use of humor was hurtful instead of funny.

[contentlove.livejournal.com]

If you have it, you are not aware of having it

Um, what if you have it and you're aware of having it and you attempt to live a reasonable life and do not assume other people have everything you have? Is it permissible under any circumstances you can imagine to enjoy one's privilege without it automatically being an affront to people who are not similarly privileged?

What if I'm a bit smarter than the other kids in my class? May I read books at my level?

[neitherday.livejournal.com]

privilege is consistently responding to disagreement, criticism, and concerns with condescension and hostility, then accusing the unprivileged of being irrational, inconsistent, duplicitous, guileful, and unappeasable

This is widespread with and without various forms of privilege. For example, in feminism responding to disagreement, criticism, and concerns with condescension and hostility is par for the course.

privilege is the habit of seeking power and influence over others

Again, this is not limited to privilege. There are people in all walks of life and from all groups that seek power and influence over others. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say that it is privilege being able to expect to have that power and influence automatically.

[neitherday.livejournal.com]

While I would not blanketly say it applies to everyone, I would concur with you that it is wide spread among most strong ideologies.

[griffen.livejournal.com]

Also, power and influence are not the only driving forces behind people's actions. I vehemently dislike sociological theories that place power and influence at the top of the heap, or discount other motivations that can be just as strong... which is why I generally dislike feminist theory. It's just Marxism with a patina of gender-oppression overlain atop it, and it doesn't hold up to scrutiny.

[azaz-al.livejournal.com]

Interesting. I think the very outcry people make, as illustrated above, indicates the accuracy of the list you posted. Defense of racist, sexist jokes? How disgusting!

[sophiaserpentia.livejournal.com]

I was wondering if anyone was going to point that out. :)

[azaz-al.livejournal.com]

Trust the black bird to do these things, honey :)

Why do I not engage them? Because there's no point in talking to anyone so deliberately obtuse.

[azaz-al.livejournal.com]

You aren't worth talking to. Bye!

[sophiaserpentia.livejournal.com]

What does that have to do with the comment she made?

[daoistraver.livejournal.com]

well, actually this makes it a bit easier to explain something I wanted to explain before, that some of these things which are currently considered privilege are actually what everyone should be experiencing:

"Privilege means being able to laugh at certain kinds of joke instead of being aware of your inferiority."
"Privilege means not having to wonder, ever, if people around you are regularly putting your needs ahead of theirs."
"privilege is not having to be self-conscious and self-critical"
"privilege is the ability to start, end, and avoid discussion with little consequence"

The injustice is not that these rights exist, merely that they are not universal. On the other hand, some of the things on that list are things that no one should be entitled to:
"privilege is the habit of seeking power and influence over others"
"privilege is shelter from direct consequences"
"privilege is feeling entitled to the conformity in behaviours and attitudes of the unprivileged"

So we need to make one further distinction between the "privileges" that everyone should have, and those that no one should have.
And this is kind of what I was trying to get at in some of our prior discussions.

For instance, I experience this one in my life: "privilege is the ability to start, end, and avoid discussion with little consequence" - as I am currently in a position to withdraw from unwanted interactions. I also grant this right to everyone else around me, however.
I know society as a whole does not grant this universally to everyone and that angers me.

[sophiaserpentia.livejournal.com]

These are great points. Thank you!

[igferatu.livejournal.com]

Many of the qualities associated with privilege are not inherently bad and the problem is one of inequitable distribution

The ability to distribute or deny access to privilege can be thought of as the underlying privilege which gives rise to all others.

[akaiyume.livejournal.com]

I don't get that myself. I mean, the only way to even think that eliminating privilege would eliminate differences is to actually believe there is one quality in each set of defining elements which really is better than the others and so to be equal everyone would have to possess that quality.

Really, how hard can it be to accept different things as equally valid and worthy of equal respect. Better or worse and terms like that are so situational. With a twist of a variable, perception could change. Maybe privilege is getting to define the variables. And not even realizing that one is doing it.

[discoflamingo.livejournal.com]

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